Changes to gameplay

[c0l0n]

Well I finally stopped trolling and registered. Hi. I have 2 questions/suggestions that are old and not exactly earth shattering. Has there been any testing in ET with distance dropoff disabled, and why haven't coverts been giving a mauser-like sniper rifle yet? I realize people cry that these are both rtcw-like, but I think they would improve gameplay. I've heard bani talking about both (IIRC) and I'm just wondering if a cvar was made, like b_distancedropoff 0 (at 1 by default) and b_covertmauser 1 (0 by default) if the leagues couldn't play it and test it? I honestly think it would be like the battery and fueldump changes, people would fight at first, and then play it and like it. Less medwhoring strategies for teams, faster kills, more emphasis on shooting to clear out (smgs are relatively weak compared to explosives in ET) and advance.
Secondly, coverts are a joke. It's almost a waste of a player just for the sake of a satchel charge. A mauser isn't going to make a huge difference, especially if you implement distance dropoff removal. Anyway, just my opinions on how to improve the game, and ET Pro is a good mod that I just want to see keep improving.

[=FF=im2good4u]

distance drop off removal had a lot of votes for and again so its not quite sure wut todo whit i person hate the idea specialy for long range aiming whit a meschine gun

as for a mauser i would love it but its a big chance in game play / code since they have to add a new weapon or replce an old one and maybe need a new model for it and stuff

[Ragnar_40k]

IMHO distance drop off is OK for SMG etc. but not for (scoped) sniper or deployed/stationary/mounted MG42.

[c0l0n]

^^^ I disagree

Mobiles are another matter entirely, I'm talking specifically about smg's. They're too weak to take out defenses long range, or offenses for that matter. So what happens? Well, teams shoot it out, retreat, pack up or revive, and then return. Who does that favor? The defense. Granted defenses may be tougher to break initially, but if you get behind them, or disrupt them, they will go down faster with fewer of these long drawn out fights.

As for the covert rifle, just use the garand/k43 animation and make it a mauser. Silenced or not, doesn't matter. All that matters is the scoped damage (although you'd have to make it less accurate unscoped). Distance dropoff is my bigger concern. Others thoughts?

[skillzilla]

i wnat faster smg rate :<

[/*Demoman*/]

neither sniperrifles nor mg42 have distance falloff as it is


while the sniper rifle can get headshots... the mg42 can not

the problem with battling the mg42... at an smg's farthest distance he can get only 9 damage for a body shot and 20 for a headshot

meanwhile the mg42 is already shooting faster(smg rof 150 mg42 rof 50) and mobile does 18 damage (stationary does 20) with every shot

so while an smg with good aim is hitting the head 3 or more times... the person on the mobile doesnt die but instead mowing down the smger with 6 or 7 shots

damage by the rifle only does 68 damage to the head and 34 to the body
from a distance... you dont have a chance to whip out a pistol or knife to finish the job and then gib them

whats the point of having the rifle in ET if when you kill someone they get picked up before you can gib them?.... or meds can still run away with 2 shots in their gut and pack up?

the RTCW mauser can stop medic trains(even full revive medic trains)... it can gib faster than the k43/garand

pros and cons of the mauser sniperrifle

pro: bigger hit damage of 80 , 160 damage per headshot
con: less starting ammo than k43... 10 bullets loaded 10 in clip...
con: not accurate at all unscoped
con: disguise goes away once fired because its not silent at all
con: slower to fire than the k43/garand
con: bigger recoil than k43
con: slower reload time


being someone that sniped his whole time in both rtcw and Et.... I would rather have all those pro/cons of the RTCW rifle than the current ET rifle

the ability to stop the medics is a good thing... as well as the ability to gib before they can be revived

I have proved in my mod that the k43/garand and the mauser can co-exist with pro/cons of both

the mauser user is at a disadvantage with a lot of things but what he has a disadvantage with he makes up for with damage.

when adding in the mauser dont forget to add this in clientthink_real

Code: Select all

#define RIFLE_SHAKE_TIME 300 // per Id request, longer recoil time
	if (client->sniperRifleFiredTime) {
		if (level.time - client->sniperRifleFiredTime > RIFLE_SHAKE_TIME)
			client->sniperRifleFiredTime = 0;
		else {
			VectorCopy(client->ps.viewangles,muzzlebounce);

			// JPW per Id request, longer recoil time
			muzzlebounce[PITCH] -= 2*cos(2.5*(level.time - client->sniperRifleFiredTime)/RIFLE_SHAKE_TIME);
			muzzlebounce[YAW] += 0.5*client->sniperRifleMuzzleYaw*cos(1.0-(level.time - client->sniperRifleFiredTime)*3/RIFLE_SHAKE_TIME);
			muzzlebounce[PITCH] -= 0.25*random()*(1.0f-(level.time - client->sniperRifleFiredTime)/RIFLE_SHAKE_TIME);
			muzzlebounce[YAW] += 0.5*crandom()*(1.0f-(level.time - client->sniperRifleFiredTime)/RIFLE_SHAKE_TIME);
			SetClientViewAngle(ent,muzzlebounce);		
		}
	}

this will make the recoil go in other directions and not straight up like the k43 which will make lining up the next shot more difficult


my votes... a cvar for distancefalloff and the rtcw mauser added in those 2 things should help improve the game but not change it so much that it would play like a different game... this will be a good thing with rtcw convert maps that people complain play like crap in et

[Grizbo]

New sniper I wouldn't mind (although how it plays in ET obviously remains to be seen), but not keen on changing the fall off damage. I think defence get more opportunity to get into static positions and focus on their aim's so removing the fall off makes them more effective at picking the attackers off at long range from their established defences. You can argue both sides have the same damage potential, but due to the nature of defence (I'm thinking first stage Oasis as I write this) I think it will simply make the defence generally harder to break as its usually defence in a position to take aim and really lay fire into people.

[c0l0n]

True, but that's why maps should have multiple paths. Oasis has 4 points of entry (really 3 though), lower tunnels (2), Command Post (1), and the water pump. I'm not saying it will be perfect, we should just try it and see how it plays. No one really knows at this point.

[Spark2]

Both have been discussed in and out... The search function should show it. I doubt there is any reason to keep discussing it. Both clearly have pros and cons and now it's simply up to Bani and crew if they ever want to offer those options or not. In a nutshell the pros and cons are like this:

Pro no distance falloff:
- More fun and satisfying results for the shooter
- More easy to attack at places where offense can approach the defense from multiple angles (like Oasis second phase)

Contra no distance falloff:
- Less fun for the victim getting killed out of nowhere
- Harder to approach the defense at places where offense can NOT easily approach from multiple angles (like Oasis first phase), putting more emphasis on crossfire and less on close combat fighting

Pro Mauser:
- Would bring back the sniping fun
- Might make the covert ops a more useful class in general

Contra Mauser:
- Getting one shot killed from anywhere on the map is frustrating
- Might be too powerful on Fueldump, where some clans already successfully deploy two snipers at the first phase
- Mauser sucks for midrange fighting unlike the ET sniper, because of its low rate of fire and bad accuracy when unscoped. This could be avoided by making the sniper like the ET sniper when unscoped and like the Mauser when scoped, if that wouldn't make it too powerful

[hiro]

a mauser isn't really a covert's weapon, is it. If a soldier's gun from rtcw was to be added, it should be added as a new soldier class.

either way I really don't think we need any more encouragement for more snipers who hide up the back of pub servers doing very little to help the few members of the team who are going for the objective.

oh but this is a competition mod, right?

[c0l0n]

yes it is a competition mod, and although it is a soldier's weapon in RTCW, it is a covert ops weapon in ET, so that argument holds no water. Bani has been kind enough to add options for pubs, since ETPro fixes so many bugs and has better antilag than ETMain. I don't see a problem with making the sniper rifle suck short range, it's not designed for short range. Run around with a pistol when you're not sniping. The power of the rifle would be offset some by the distance fall off being gone. Although I'm not sure if the more accurate smg's in ET might make long range shooting very deadly, but then again they do fire slower. I know it's up to Bani et al but I just wanted to throw out my opinion and keep it on their minds.

[B4tt3rY]

the distance falloff is VERY Annoying, ive given people 5 headshots and they were still able to run....

and from a distance 1 on 1s can waste almost all ur clip.

so i beleive to take away distance fall off and increase ROF

[Nail]

the distance falloff is VERY Annoying, ive given people 5 headshots and they were still able to run....

and from a distance 1 on 1s can waste almost all ur clip.

so i beleive to take away distance fall off and increase ROF

get closer, the falloff affects everyone equally

[>>steven!]

rof should be left alone, its fine the way it is.

rate of fall off i aint too bothered about, ive got 5 headshots on ppl and still not killed them, but im sure ppl have done the same to me.

mauser should be soldier class, and would really spice up the tactics in ET again, (just like that mortar script did), i think would freshen up the game alot tbh.

can ppl stop whining plz about rambos on publics, ur always going to get this is any game that involves ppl working together for an objective.

sheesh i dont even play objective on publics as i want sum fun, i dont find it fun walking round building things/planting dynos and taking objectives to waypoints cos u just get sum nub who mucks it up for u and it gets frustrating.

however i do find this fun in competition mode, because i am a competitive person and like to take part in things (and win ), and i have alot of trust in my teamm8s abilities!

ps. demoman from alias???, if so when was u a sniper :S:S and hey!, if not ill be quiet

[dA*Rogue]

Taking away the distance fall-off would make it easier for Axis to gun down advancing Allies. Axis can generally sit and wait, while Allies have to be pushing forward as well. I think this would help the defence more than offence, and it's okay as is.

Rate of fire would be cool if it was a little faster, but I doubt there'd ever be consensus on changing it (omg it might be more like another game).