ET Pro 3.1.15 Public Beta Release

[Ragnar_40k]

The point of my post is, that it is a void argument not to fix a bug/exploit, because you "IF your good enough".
You can justify nearly anything with "IF your good enough".

[wipeout]

the hatred of prone has NOTHING to do with whether it's realistic or not. the entire wolfenstein franchise is a fucking cartoon. nobody wants it to be realistic (nobody with brains anyway).

the problem is due to FLAWS in prone which cause shots which would have otherwise registered, to NOT register. THAT is the crux of the issue. i don't care if you twirl around like a ballerina during a duel, just as long as my shots register properly.

not sure if the issue has been fixed, but until it has been, proning in a duel should be viewed for precisely what it is: an exploit.

I think its time you build a bridge and get over it.. part of the game, there is no hatred for it, IF your good enough, you will kill the proner anyway.

Maybe if your shots would register correctly

[Etnies`]

When someone prones i jump and run behind them or to the side, seems to beat that it.

[Etnies`]

The point of my post is, that it is a void argument not to fix a bug/exploit, because you "IF your good enough".
You can justify nearly anything with "IF your good enough".

lol i didnt justify "nearly everything" i used it once, 9/10 if someone prones in front of me i kill them.. and i know im not the only one who can kill a proner easy either. and your post was useless.. as i said trying to smart.

[ouroboro]

no. your posts are useless, because they don't add to the discussion. what you're saying is "ok fine, there's a flaw. it doesn't bother me, so just overlook it."

the problem is, the flaw remains. look, nobody is claiming proners are hard to kill. not in etpro anyway (shrub is another matter. prone hitboxes so fubar'ed you stand a better chance getting a headshot if you aim 180 degrees away from the target). the point is that in high level competition, you don't generally get away with sloppy bullshit. encounters are precise, and every shot counts. miss a headshot and it's your life. that's fine, in fact that's great - that's why it's fun, it's a challenge, a rush. but if i miss a shot not because i really did miss, but because my target KNOWINGLY used the prone sequence to deny me the hit - we now have what's known as an exploit.

should that not be fixed if possible?

at any rate, i'm not even sure it's ever happened to me. who's to say? but since the flaw has been revealed, there's no harm in fixing it. as i said before, i don't give a shit if you hop around like a fool, do pirouettes, prone, crouch, sprint, do a backflip, or stand on your head - just as long as when i land a legitimate shot on you, it counts as it should. when i see a proner, i don't say to myself "oh noes, wtf do i do?! he's lying down, whereas an instant ago he was standing! where did he go? i can't calculate fast enough to come up with a resolution to this conundrum!" it's more like this, in my case: "you little bastard, i know what ur trying to do, and it better not work for you this time" (because as has been shown, sometimes the flaw happens, sometimes it doesn't). when i lose a 1v1 to a guy who's popping up and down like a jack-in-the-box, i always wonder if it was a legit loss - because i wonder if i was robbed of a shot, not because i can't hit a stationary target

[DG]

the UI seems to show players certain voting options which the server has disabled, e.g. cointoss. trying to select the vote only results in the message about "sorry the server has this option disabled" message though.

[Etnies`]

My point is.. It wont happen to you half as much or even at all.. if you do what i said, so why 'fix' it, if you can beat the person who is doing it, and also if your thinking "you little bastard, i know what ur trying to do, and it better not work for you this time" your not focused on what your doing and you'll probally be killed anyway. and how are my posts useless? its my OPINION.. your posts were not an opinion it was just another usless post like 'lol' or 'yes'.

[ReyalP]

Maybe if your shots would register correctly

Those demos don't show any 'bug' or 'exploit' that I can see. In the 'bug' demos, the shooter is clearly shooting over the height of the prone hitbox. If he gets any hits, it is because of getting lucky with spread.

Quite why he expects to hit a proner while not aiming at him, I don't know.

but because my target KNOWINGLY used the prone sequence to deny me the hit

just like using +left or +movedown to KNOWINGLY deny you a hit

but since the flaw has been revealed

really ? where ?

[zinx]

The flaw in question was indeed making the hitbox too -large-, rather than too small. antilag didn't properly adjust things if you were ahead of that player in time, or vice versa (i don't remember which), making the bbox larger than it should have been, causing some of the hits to register.

[SoL]

Those demos don't show any 'bug' or 'exploit' that I can see. In the 'bug' demos, the shooter is clearly shooting over the height of the prone hitbox. If he gets any hits, it is because of getting lucky with spread.

Quite why he expects to hit a proner while not aiming at him, I don't know.

The point is that the hitbox doesn't coincide with the animation at all, and i know there are many, many examples of this in ET, but not many which can be done on purpose and so distracting.

If you watch the demo in timescale 0.1, as prescribed, you will see that a couple of shots don't register when they clearly appear to be hitting the animation. When this happens almost everytime someone prones, and when you can prone whenever you want, i think that is hitbox exploitation. Many players, even from top EuroCup clans, prone, i doubt they would do it if they were so extremely easy to kill like everyone claims.

[Tron]

The last two replies (-edit- above sol's reply -edit-) seem to imply that the "correct" behavior should be that the hitbox goes from standing up to prone instantly.

Quite why he expects to hit a proner while not aiming at him, I don't know.

Are you trying to take me for a fool? The point of the demos was always to show that you don't score a hit when you aim at a player who is still going prone. If you contest that that should be possible (despite the very quick movement when going prone which in fact would bring up a whole other issue - just compare the speed at which you go prone with the speed at which you crouch), then you seem indeed to confirm my first sentence. And if that is the case (note all the "if's" ), I must say - with all due respect I have for you because you contributed with many good points to discussions in ET - you completely lack the sense for competitive play in this respect. If I have the opportunity to warp my (head) position vertically (instead of horizontally, which is mostly fixed by b_antiwarp, although I have a demo which shows otherwise) by a considerable distance, why should I not make use of it the most often possible?

Thankfully, I'm not playing ET anymore apart from the odd public server round. I can't really be bothered with getting into these discussions again. I just couldn't let your comment unreplied because you alleged something which was just wrong.

[ouroboro]

just like using +left or +movedown to KNOWINGLY deny you a hit

lol, nah, that doesn't work on me - i can track this flaw is different, in that being able to aim is not rewarded, but rather LANDED shots are denied.

anyway i'm just mouthing what i've heard and seen, like i said i have no way to tell if it's ever happened to me. i'm just taking the word of people who sound like they know what they're talking about.

you know, kinda like we all do regarding you, reyalP (teasing)

[gotenks]

when you prone your a: hitbox does change and b: your spread lowers
it's a good idea to prone, but not generally in a close range fight...

[Kendle]

Many players, even from top EuroCup clans, prone, i doubt they would do it if they were so extremely easy to kill like everyone claims.

Hits nail on head. That's the thing about proning, everyone claims to have no problem with proners but plenty still do it. Why? If it's no advantage?

And when BiO*SoL and BiO*Tron (both ex-UK's No.1 ET Clan with vast EuroCup experience) have an issue with proning doesn't that suggest there's "a problem" to be dealt with here?

[sgone:red.]

And when BiO*SoL and BiO*Tron (both ex-UK's No.1 ET Clan with vast EuroCup experience) have an issue with proning doesn't that suggest there's "a problem" to be dealt with here?

Not really no. Must disagree there.

Sorry Kendle, 99% of the time I agree with you, but what makes them any different from us? In fact, I would say the people who frequent this forum are just as clued up in ET and its gameplay as they are, even more so.

I think you'll find the higher up the "skill" ladder people go, the more they whinge about every little thing. Well at least that's what I tend to find and I'm sure you've noticed yourself Kendle in certain instances.

Ok, so maybe the prone boxes are a little "out" and agree that given the time, why not fix them, but I would certainly not say it's an exploit in it's current state. When the whole regular proning on servers began, I hold up my hands and say yes, I was constantly caught out by them, but like all gamers you have to adapt and learn from these situations. I generally have difficulty killing proners in two instances alone. These are when they are a fair distance away, and in the last few seconds of a firefight. You do find people who, dare i say it, prone professionally. These people have made an art of it and are very skilled in its use. This is why my previous post said I kill 90% of proners.

An certainly no disrespect to those against proning, but I personally think you might need to adapt...... like I did.